Manu prāt, būtu vērts atgriezties pie oriģinālās tēmas, re:

So, do you leave the ethnic minority disenfranchised, but with individual freedom of speech in tact? I realize that this solution would not be a move towards conciliation, but…

Also, is this something that must be emphasized in discussions with the West re the ethnic minority issue?

Does Latvia need an active voice for silnaya ruka or should it be precluded? I understand that there may be Latvians who hold this position as well.

IMO no doubt the silnaya ruka is necessary, from time to time; it depends on how you define silnaya ruka. At one point above, I likened it to a chain saw. There are other ways.

Since the great powers are unlikely to go to war with each other, it is quite possible these days to fight wars by proxy. However, even proxy wars may bring the big powers to the point of almost having a world war. How do you fight in such a situation?

You rent out nuclear bombs. You do what is believed to be impossible, but then as the Marines say, the impossible takes us only a little longer.

What if lil ol Latvia rented a nuclear bomb, big and heavy from some nation somewhere. Assuming that Latvia has no rockets to deliver the bomb, It is possible that it will simply burry the bomb at some uninhabited region of Latgale and let the bomb vibrate its message—whatever it be Latvia wants to send.

One could also hang such a bomb under ten hot air balloons, catch a West wind, and let the shebang drift East. Why would one want to do such a thing? Because someone wrote somewhere above that the Russians have not given up their idea to someday get Latvia back into being part of Federated Russia again.

Unfortunately for Russia, it cannot simply send a wee little thing over Riga, because so many disenranchised
Russians of Latvian descent live there. So here is a window for Raivis Dzintars to get a volunteer crew of Latvian hot air balloonists to get the Latvian bombflymobile off the ground.

So, do you leave the ethnic minority disenfranchised…

Cut back on the john’s-milk, Jancīt.

/P

The worst, bestest part of your latest ravings, Jaņdž—

Unfortunately for Russia, it cannot simply send a wee little thing over Riga, because so many disenranchised Russians of Latvian descent live there.

(1) Russians of Latvian descent? Huh?

(2) If you mean compatriots so-called—when has Russia ever hesitated to slaughter Russians? I just finished Bloodlands, which Aleksejs was kind enough to bestow upon me. Mebbe you should read it. Russia has spent a great deal of its history slaughtering Russians, without compunction. I think most Latvians know that. Most Latvians of Russian descent, even.

And mebbe you should fleetingly consider that the current quasi-dictator, Lt. Col. Putin, came to popularity and power by bombing a Russian city “back to the Stone Age.”

Visu to gaišāko,
/P

P/ Why not be the first to volunteer to fly the hot air balloon to Moscow?
If the subject matter of this thread passed you by, read the entry at the top of page 15.
The question posed there is the subject matter of this thread, raised by one ‘vinde’.
My contribution begins with the sentence: IMO….

…………So, do you leave the ethnic minority disenfranchised, but with individual freedom of speech in tact? I realize that this solution would not be a move towards conciliation, but…
Also, is this something that must be emphasized in discussions with the West re the ethnic minority issue? …………

It should be obvious by now to anyone following the news in the Latvian media that it is engaged in self-censorship. If one were to listen to the news of the Latvian media alone, one would exit (at some point hopefully) gummy as overcooked rice or mealy macaroni.

This is one reason, why sites such as LOL, will someday have Latvian readers, because English—though the propaganda is also obviously at the overcooked stage and never credible at face value—nevertheless has many contrary thinkers and an intellectual tradition far more versatile than Latvia is able to cook up.

Russians of Latvian descent or, better, Russians of Baltic descent, are as many in Russia as Russians of German descent. At one time, these minorities were welcomed to Russia as, both, a factor that enabled Russia to learn from the West, as well as transfer the western work ethic to the freewheeling ways (the Wild East) of a people used to the freedoms of the forest.

In the course of time, the Russian government also used these same Russians of Baltic descent to its advantage by sending them back to the West, where they were supposed to re-educate a people increasingly subjected to the machine and come to accept taxation as a God given opportunity for the government echelons to take over as a self-enclosed system, a sort of “religion”, specifically, a newfangled “Latvian religion”.

The Latvian government today is into viewing itself as a “religion”; and the more nationalist, the more it becomes a “religion”. This also why “with individual freedom of speech in tact”, the Russian element in Latvia may begin to represent “freedom of speech” for all Latvians. Latvians as a whole are not there yet, but we are fast moving there led by the moral integrity movement holding sway over the Latvian parliamentary paganka kleptocracija. I.e., just like the American blacks once has a slogan “It’s a black thang”  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3e-OgxFZeE  (that no whitey would understand), the zionationalist wing is trying to float a “Latvianism thang”, which unfortunately has no basis in reality unless it be the latest shoot from the old fascist stem.

I read somewhere, that one reason some Russians are pushing the Russian language thing, is to have Russian language accepted as an official language in European political circles. If this is so, I have no objections, because the Russians could get this privilege by paying Latvia in something that Latvians need or want. In short, at a time when many in Latvia go malnourished and the land is sold cheap to the Scandinavians the future should be negotiated through positive bargaining, rather than pseudo religious zionationalism for a coatrack or robbing Latvians of their country.

Aleksejs,
Download and read:

“The Geopolitics of History in Latvian-Russian Realtions.pdf”
Written 2011?
Look it up on Google ... about 9Mb ... 250+ pages ...a long read.
I’ve only skimmed through it so far.
Very interesting. points, skimmed in that process

Maybe I’m not the only one that hasn’t “moved on” vs ruSSia that hasn’t moved at all?

How history is written? By the perpetuators or by the suppressed?
Needless to say ... both.
“Revisionist / re-writing history?

Oh Russia hasn’t moved on at all. No one here has suggested otherwise. You just shouldn’t equate Russians who live in Latvia, aka Russian Latvians with Russian politicians that rule the Kremlin. As Russians here provide election fodder to the nationalist-minded parties, so does hating Estonia-Latvia-America-Insert-Your-Own-Country for Russian politicians. That is all. Just look at how Putin dealt with the internal opposition by blaming the US State Department.

The theme of this thread is Ethnic minorities in Latvia. The Kremlin, of course, uses the local Russian population in its political games. This is why it’s important to resolve the issues here, so that the Kremlin couldn’t get a foothold. Blaming the Russians here in all ills that befall Latvia is rather silly and doesn’t do anyone any good.

One could write the whole dissertation on memory politics and how conflicting historical memories find their way into the Latvian society.

For the umpteenth time…..........if russians in Latvia would all get their citizenship
and use their vote, they could have their own govenment. Latvian, i presume?

what does citizenship have to do with it? I didn’t mention citizenship. According to the immigration data, there are more Russians who are citizens of Latvia then who are non-citizens. And regardless of their dirty pathetic politics, it appears to me that Harmony Centre is perhaps the most integrated party there is.

their dirty pathetic politics, it appears to me that Harmony Centre is perhaps the most integrated party there is.

they are united indeed, but not about Latvia.

The Bees used to be together….............so were the Orange ones.
and so was CCCP.

You’re changing the subject: what does the citizenship have to do with any of it?

PS And the “orange ones” (I assume the People’s Party) was voted in by, ahem, Latvians as well. Heck, even endorsed by Diena. Rewriting history much?

The theme of this thread is Ethnic minorities in Latvia. The Kremlin, of course, uses the local Russian population in its political games. This is why it’s important to resolve the issues here, so that the Kremlin couldn’t get a foothold. Blaming the Russians here in all ills that befall Latvia is rather silly and doesn’t do anyone any good.”

if all of these Kremlin puppets were citizens of Latvia….....................

sheesh, you figure it out .

Kremlin puppets? Who are the Kremlin puppets? The fact that the Kremlin uses any division to its advantage isn’t just a Latvian thing. Look at how the Kremlin deals with the EU as a whole. Perhaps, Schroeder should be stripped of his German citizenship, eh?

PS And what is that terrible thing that would happen if there were no non-citizens?

I presume it was a rhetorical presumption,
re: “....if russians in Latvia would all get their citizenship and use their vote, they could have their own govenment. Latvian, i presume?”

If indeed I were to go along with the presumption, then, I think, it is more accurate to presume that Russia may get a foot into the door of the EU. But then it is only a presumption, not even mine in this instance.

As to the politics of the EU elite, I recomment the following link, starting at about 2:20:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83PE-h-rnzI&feature=relmfu .

Indeed, I agree, that Europe was more independent minded right after WW2 than it is now, when no one is threatening it, unless the threat be a ricochet from the consequences of its own policies.

Russia will be celebrating Russia Day on June 12, a day that marks essentially its “independence day.” With the frequently quoted Col. Putin’s “the greatest geopolitical catastrophe,” it is interesting to see that 54 percent of Russians say that Russia is better off after its “independence.” As Putin tightens screws on protesters ahead of June 12, it is also interesting that 37 percent of Russians are against the new law while 69 percent believe that Putin should engage with the opposition.

Russia will be playing the host country Poland in the Euro 2012 on June 12 as soccer fans petitioned to hold a rally in the Warsaw city centre. As a result of troubles after the game against Czech Republic, Russia appealed to fans and in an attempt to smooth things over with Poland, soccer officials laid wreaths at the 2010 plane crash victims memorial.